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THE HINTS- VITAL TO SUCCESS
05-09-2019, 11:56 PM, (This post was last modified: 05-10-2019, 12:00 AM by Top Secret.)
RE: THE HINTS- VITAL TO SUCCESS
(06-08-2018, 04:10 PM)Top Secret Wrote:
(06-08-2018, 02:59 PM)Seannm Wrote: All,
I am the Chase's smartest treasure hunter, come and see me talk about myself on my self-centered youtube show, where you can see how perfect I really am.
Seannm
[Image: Ev657E0.png]
Continuing on with Seannm the walking contradiction & Mr. know-it-all's foot in mouth disease. I got a really good laugh tonight when I read a recent post form Seannm
where he thinks Fenn's response to school kids to read TTOTC is a vote for Poem Purists and the smart ones at MW tore him a new one.

Sometimes I wonder if he ever stops to consider how his posts make him an absolute idiot. Case in point, Poem purist only use the poem yet,
Seannm cites a "non-poem, non-TTOTC source" as proof that the poem is all you need to find the treasure"

Man you just can't make this stuff up. If there was a Darwin award for treasure hunters, seannm is a shoe-in.
Reply
05-14-2019, 02:45 PM, (This post was last modified: 05-14-2019, 02:47 PM by fundamental design.)
RE: THE HINTS- VITAL TO SUCCESS
Some poem purists’ (I know, but I didn’t come up with the term) foundations rely on their often said advice that TTOTC book is filled with so many rabbit holes that it ain’t worth the time spent on going that route.

Like...how’s it going without the book then?

Then, we have this recently from Cynthia...

05-12-2019, 02:38 PM
RE: Why Frosty?
Once I asked Forrest why he changed Old Fred to Frosty and Miss Mary to Grandma. I asked him if it was to protect the actual people he's referring to? He looked at me like I was on crack and said I was "nit-picking". IMO, they are not hints. Once again, this is an example of "so many searchers stomping on the ants while the elephants run by." IMO.
__________________________________________

I agree with that being nit-picking and that kind of hunt for the few hints would constitute into minutia. That’s why I’ve never gone the route of looking for that kind of answer to some of the things f wrote about in the book. I have been saying for years that I don’t think that is what constitutes as a hint. I give f much more credit for creating suberb hints in his Chase. If the tc is ever found, it’ll be the hints that shine the way, if the finder tells their story.

Pays to be a winner.
Reply
05-15-2019, 08:57 AM,
RE: THE HINTS- VITAL TO SUCCESS
Everyone. Lol

Pays to be a winner.
Reply
05-22-2019, 09:46 AM,
RE: THE HINTS- VITAL TO SUCCESS
Interesting to reflect back on how f defined the hints in the book in the beginning of the Chase. He used the terms “subtle clues”. I’m not sure of exactly when f updated his terminology of that by using the word “hints”.

The aspect I see interesting is why didn’t he use the word hint in the beginning to describe the hints in the book, lol. I mean, that is what the word hint is used for in all kinds of mysterious applications. It certainly seems more apt to be used than the awkward phrase of “subtle clues”.

It’s not like he didn’t use the word hint in the poem. Ahhh...that’s it, he was trying to mask the trail that there is an actual hint in the poem since he has/will never comment(ed) about that aspect of the poem before explicitly.

I might try and make myself some room at Top Secret’s autographing booth later on. I can only sign for half an hour.

Pays to be a winner.
Reply
06-14-2019, 09:28 AM, (This post was last modified: 06-14-2019, 10:11 AM by fundamental design.)
RE: THE HINTS- VITAL TO SUCCESS
Sorry for the long post...

Thought I’d review and comment on the latest Flipside video where they were talking about subjectivity and objectivity in the Chase again. They sure like that subject even though they seem to only scratch the surface of it. Like mostly obvious projections and views from the view of a poem purist. I do think they should bring someone in addition to Decall to help explain how some non poem purists view the topic.

I’ll go over a few things that stood out. Sean brought up early that I recently posted on ChaseChat this “I think one thing poem purists haven’t figured out is many who aren’t poem purists prbly still spend 98-99% of their solving time on the poem.”

Later he repeated it and then said that the small percentage of the solving time by the non poem purists not used on the poem is what trips them up. It gets them so far out of the box, looking into historical figures, or history in general, and leads to naive assumptions that lead you to these rabbit holes.

He says that like every non poem purist does that. Sounds to me like he’s cherry picking some solves he’s read or heard and placing every non poem purist in that same boat. That isn’t being objective. What’s wrong with looking into history? Is that forbidden? Sean already agreed with me before that history is involved emphatically with the Chase. That’s what an objective person would figure out. So, why try to diss it now? I don’t get it.

It’s not like I’m worried about wacky solutions I hear having any chance on interfering with the one, certain process of solving it all. Is he saying that no poem purist’s solve is subjective or one can’t find something weird (subjective) in it? Here’s a challenge. Let’s see some poem purists solves (complete or incomplete) that have been released before or someone wants to step up to the plate. Has there ever been a complete poem purist solve that went public? I’ll do an objective analysis of that solve and post it back to the community. I’ll just look into the objectivity and subjectivity angle of the solve and point out what I find.

I think the poem purists on the show think they are more objective than all non poem purists. I wouldn’t even answer half the questions or topics they brought up on the show because they are subjective. Like when Sean asked their opinion on get back in the box and if that means get back to the poem only or ttotc book in general which includes the poem. It’s subjective...you ain’t ever gonna figure that out so who cares.

Another point Sean was trying to make was that he believes f has changed his advice from years of it being (paraphrased) read the poem very slowly many times then read the book looking for hints that will help you with the clues in the poem. Sean thinks he changed that by more recently advising newcomers to the Chase to read his poem only.

What Sean misses is that it is important to look at adjectives and such around nouns. Just like when Sean points out we need to do that in the poem when they were discussing “warm” in the poem. Decall essentially brought up that he didn’t think synonyms were the best route to go in the poem (subjective rabbit holes) but Sean said f did that with his definition of “warm”...and that surrounding words are needed to be defined for context. Ok, then you are forgetting an important word that f has used to describe his advice about read the poem and then the book to find hints to help the clues. F said that was his “best” advice. Hard to beat his best advice if he doesn’t ever say later something else is his best advice. One’s best advice doesn’t change when you give other advice later on. One can give advice on many levels or topics after giving one’s “best” advice on how to find the treasure and it doesn’t supplant it.

When they immediately got stuck on the subjectivity/objectivity of the word warm in the first clue, it goes to what I’ve been posting for a long time on this thread. The clues are subjective. I believe you ain’t ever gonna figure out where the treasure is by just looking at the clues. I’ve said from OP of this thread that it’s my thinking that the hints in the Chase are what someone can find some piece of objectivity in them. Sean often mischaracterizes that position to mean I only talking about hints in the book. Nope, I’ve repeatedly said hints in the book and poem. I didn’t differentiate the two when I first said it’s the hints.

For example this question:

Dear Forrest,

You tell us that we should find “where warm waters halt” before trying to solve any of the other clues. Imagining that we haven’t seen the rest of the poem, and all we have to go on is:

a. “begin it where warm waters halt” and

b. “somewhere in the mountains north of Santa Fe”

Do you think that we can confidently determine the starting place for your treasure trail?

Steve No, if all you have to go on are those two clues you cannot proceed with confidence. Look at it this way. If you were making a cake and you left out a few ingredients, would you achieve your goal?

The gang on the show did produce the idea that there’s prbly something important in the first stanza of the poem. I agree with that and that’s what I’ve been saying for a long time on this thread and elsewhere. I’ve gone into great detail why, instead of just the obvious opinion, that it’s important.

F says you can’t proceed with confidence with those two clues where wwwh is one of them. You didn’t get to see the rest of the poem. The clues are consecutive. First clue is wwwh. Pretty much means the first stanza is where you get help figuring out wwwh. It has the word “hint” in it. I’d like Sean to read out loud the poem to us with how f defines the word hint for us...

As I’ve gone alone in there
And with my treasures bold
I can keep my secret where
And hint (help us with the clues) of riches new and old

Treasure hunters in the Chase don’t need a synonym for the word hint. It is self explanatory just like the word clue is. They can’t be interchanged though according to f or he wouldn’t have defined them in a different way.

So, is the hint in the first stanza objective or subjective? Is a recipe objective or subjective? If you leave out a few ingredients in a recipe then you are doing some subjective cooking/baking. A recipe is objective, it’s the fault of the one following the recipe if they don’t precisely follow the recipe by missing ingredients. If we need to follow the clues precisely sounds like f is saying we need to follow the hints precisely too. Some will “say sounds like” is subjective. If you say that, then I’ll say I think you want f to hold your hand and take you to the tc himself. You got to figure some things out by yourself and it’s not gonna be an objective route the whole way through the 9 clues. I’m saying the only part of the correct clue path that will have a taste of objectivity will be any of the hints you figure out. The rest just “hinges” on that.

Pays to be a winner.
Reply
06-14-2019, 09:58 AM,
RE: THE HINTS- VITAL TO SUCCESS
What the ?
Reply
06-14-2019, 10:43 AM, (This post was last modified: 06-14-2019, 10:43 AM by dude here.)
RE: THE HINTS- VITAL TO SUCCESS
(06-14-2019, 09:28 AM)fundamental design Wrote: Thought I’d review and comment on the latest Flipside video where they were talking about subjectivity and objectivity in the Chase again.

Seanm is irrelevant. He made himself irrelevant by dismissing the hints vital to success. Without those hints, it could take him a thousand years to happen upon the correct solve. He's like that monkey with the typewriter who will eventually reproduce the complete works of Shakespeare.

(06-14-2019, 09:28 AM)fundamental design Wrote: Sean already agreed with me before that history is involved emphatically with the Chase. That’s what an objective person would figure out. So, why try to diss it now? I don’t get it.

There is not much history involved.

(06-14-2019, 09:28 AM)fundamental design Wrote: For example this question:

Dear Forrest,

You tell us that we should find “where warm waters halt” before trying to solve any of the other clues. Imagining that we haven’t seen the rest of the poem, and all we have to go on is:

a. “begin it where warm waters halt” and

b. “somewhere in the mountains north of Santa Fe”

Do you think that we can confidently determine the starting place for your treasure trail?

Steve No, if all you have to go on are those two clues you cannot proceed with confidence. Look at it this way. If you were making a cake and you left out a few ingredients, would you achieve your goal?

The gang on the show did produce the idea that there’s prbly something important in the first stanza of the poem. I agree with that and that’s what I’ve been saying for a long time on this thread and elsewhere. I’ve gone into great detail why, instead of just the obvious opinion, that it’s important.

F says you can’t proceed with confidence with those two clues where wwwh is one of them. You didn’t get to see the rest of the poem. The clues are consecutive. First clue is wwwh. Pretty much means the first stanza is where you get help figuring out wwwh. It has the word “hint” in it. I’d like Sean to read out loud the poem to us with how f defines the word hint for us...

I disagree with your conclusion here. I don't think Mr F meant that you need the first stanza to have confidence in the starting location. He is just saying that you need the other ingredients to make that cake.
Reply
06-14-2019, 12:01 PM, (This post was last modified: 06-15-2019, 07:02 AM by fundamental design.)
RE: THE HINTS- VITAL TO SUCCESS
(06-14-2019, 10:43 AM)dude here Wrote:
(06-14-2019, 09:28 AM)fundamental design Wrote: [quote="fundamental design" pid='223099' dateline='1560522525']
Sean already agreed with me before that history is involved emphatically with the Chase. That’s what an objective person would figure out. So, why try to diss it now? I don’t get it.

There is not much history involved.

I believe there is. Do you say that objectively? And if so, what do you cite that helps you say that?

It depends on what type of history you’re talking about. The Chase has been going on for 9 years or so. All of that 9 years is history along with all that has been produced in that time. It’s just more recent history than the history where f says he wishes he was born 50 years (is that the correct number?) earlier. It’s all relative. That is exactly what I told Sean and where he finally agreed that there is history involved in the Chase...especially if it’s not found in another 10,20, 50 or more 100 or more years from now. It’s undeniable. The question is does any of that history help us with the clues. Maps don’t have too many futuristic landmarks printed on them. Lol

(06-14-2019, 10:43 AM)dude here Wrote:
(06-14-2019, 09:28 AM)fundamental design Wrote: [quote="fundamental design" pid='223099' dateline='1560522525']
For example this question:

Dear Forrest,

You tell us that we should find “where warm waters halt” before trying to solve any of the other clues. Imagining that we haven’t seen the rest of the poem, and all we have to go on is:

a. “begin it where warm waters halt” and

b. “somewhere in the mountains north of Santa Fe”

Do you think that we can confidently determine the starting place for your treasure trail?

Steve No, if all you have to go on are those two clues you cannot proceed with confidence. Look at it this way. If you were making a cake and you left out a few ingredients, would you achieve your goal?

The gang on the show did produce the idea that there’s prbly something important in the first stanza of the poem. I agree with that and that’s what I’ve been saying for a long time on this thread and elsewhere. I’ve gone into great detail why, instead of just the obvious opinion, that it’s important.

F says you can’t proceed with confidence with those two clues where wwwh is one of them. You didn’t get to see the rest of the poem. The clues are consecutive. First clue is wwwh. Pretty much means the first stanza is where you get help figuring out wwwh. It has the word “hint” in it. I’d like Sean to read out loud the poem to us with how f defines the word hint for us...

I disagree with your conclusion here. I don't think Mr F meant that you need the first stanza to have confidence in the starting location. He is just saying that you need the other ingredients to make that cake.

So, where else do you find something that helps you have confidence in the starting location if not the first stanza? I’m pretty sure f tied the two outcomes together in his answer.

Pays to be a winner.
Reply
06-14-2019, 01:08 PM,
RE: THE HINTS- VITAL TO SUCCESS
(06-14-2019, 12:01 PM)fundamental design Wrote:
(06-14-2019, 10:43 AM)dude here Wrote:
(06-14-2019, 09:28 AM)fundamental design Wrote: [quote="fundamental design" pid='223099' dateline='1560522525']
Sean already agreed with me before that history is involved emphatically with the Chase. That’s what an objective person would figure out. So, why try to diss it now? I don’t get it.

There is not much history involved.

I believe there is. Do you say that objectively? And if so, what do you cite that helps you say that?

It depends on what type of history you’re talking about. The Chase has been going on for 8 years or so. All of that 8 years is history along with all that has been produced in that time. It’s just more recent history than the history where f says he wishes he was born 50 years (is that the correct number?) earlier. It’s all relative. That is exactly what I told Sean and where he finally agreed that there is history involved in the Chase...especially if it’s not found in another 10,20, 50 or more 100 or more years from now. It’s undeniable. The question is does any of that history help us with the clues. Maps don’t have too many futuristic landmarks printed on them. Lol

I'm just saying there is not much of what we normally refer to as the subject history (e.g. modern history, ancient history, Native American history, etc).

To solve it, you basically interpret what the clues are saying and match that to a place or feature. It's that simple. There is no deep meaning, you won't find religion or the meaning of life. You read the poem and the book, figure out what he means, and identify a location. Repeat that for the nine clues. You get a lot of gold in the end and that's all he promised.

Doing that is hard enough. And I've looked at the historical and cultural and political hints he provided too. It's part of the process. You have to go down those rabbit holes or you'll feel like you've left something out. But the bottom line is, that stuff is not crucial. You have to tune in and get what he is saying. That's what's crucial.

(06-14-2019, 12:01 PM)fundamental design Wrote:
(06-14-2019, 10:43 AM)dude here Wrote:
(06-14-2019, 09:28 AM)fundamental design Wrote: [quote="fundamental design" pid='223099' dateline='1560522525']
For example this question:

Dear Forrest,

You tell us that we should find “where warm waters halt” before trying to solve any of the other clues. Imagining that we haven’t seen the rest of the poem, and all we have to go on is:

a. “begin it where warm waters halt” and

b. “somewhere in the mountains north of Santa Fe”

Do you think that we can confidently determine the starting place for your treasure trail?

Steve No, if all you have to go on are those two clues you cannot proceed with confidence. Look at it this way. If you were making a cake and you left out a few ingredients, would you achieve your goal?

The gang on the show did produce the idea that there’s prbly something important in the first stanza of the poem. I agree with that and that’s what I’ve been saying for a long time on this thread and elsewhere. I’ve gone into great detail why, instead of just the obvious opinion, that it’s important.

F says you can’t proceed with confidence with those two clues where wwwh is one of them. You didn’t get to see the rest of the poem. The clues are consecutive. First clue is wwwh. Pretty much means the first stanza is where you get help figuring out wwwh. It has the word “hint” in it. I’d like Sean to read out loud the poem to us with how f defines the word hint for us...

I disagree with your conclusion here. I don't think Mr F meant that you need the first stanza to have confidence in the starting location. He is just saying that you need the other ingredients to make that cake.

So, where else do you find something that helps you have confidence in the starting location if not the first stanza? I’m pretty sure f tied the two outcomes together in his answer.

It could be in the first stanza. But if the first clue is in the second stanza, then maybe it's there.
Reply
06-14-2019, 03:45 PM,
RE: THE HINTS- VITAL TO SUCCESS
For the record, not that anybody cares, I agree with what DudeHere wrote above. He worries me.

"There is not much history involved."

&

"I'm just saying there is not much of what we normally refer to as the subject history (e.g. modern history, ancient history, Native American history, etc).

To solve it, you basically interpret what the clues are saying and match that to a place or feature. It's that simple. There is no deep meaning, you won't find religion or the meaning of life. You read the poem and the book, figure out what he means, and identify a location. Repeat that for the nine clues. You get a lot of gold in the end and that's all he promised.

Doing that is hard enough. And I've looked at the historical and cultural and political hints he provided too. It's part of the process. You have to go down those rabbit holes or you'll feel like you've left something out. But the bottom line is, that stuff is not crucial. You have to tune in and get what he is saying. That's what's crucial."

I think we'll find out eventually.
Reply


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