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Devils Advocate
02-27-2014, 04:51 PM,
Devils Advocate

<div class="bbcode_quote_head">Quote:
<b>Quote from Buddy Allen on February 28, 2014, 10:10 am</b>

I am 50+ years old but I was an Air Force brat as a kid. I can tell you from personal experience that they don't just stick any old body in an AF jet, let alone a jet carrying nukes. I can tell you all of those guys are straight shooters.

Forrest Graduated Best in Class at "FLYING" Pilot Training... ( Not Academics, finished 350 in his class at Academics )

Forrest was accepted into PILOT TRAINING on the BASIS of his being able to pass a PULL MOTOR test... Bainbridge Ga. as a non-college CADET... most other PILOT TRAINING students were College-Graduated OFFICERS... 419 Students, ALL COLLEGE-GRADUATED OFFICERS, aeronautical engineers, masters. PHd's etc, except Forrest a few others.

<b>Listen Guys, I may not be the tallest tree in the forest, and I don't know the wingspan of an F-100, but I am smart enough to know if I have to fly it through a hole that size, I will go out and measure it before I leave.

If I ever need an airplane built, I'll call you, but if you ever need one flown, you call me.</b> - Forrest Fenn


02-27-2014, 05:55 PM,
Devils Advocate
What if it's about an elderly man's legacy? A man who hopes that 120 years from now, an internet search of his name will produce pages about how he brought a sense of adventure and hope to thousands of people and motivated them to go searching for a treasure that he hid. The treasure was eventually found in ________ by _________. Tourism in the Rocky Mountains and National parks increased and hotels had record bookings during the search (not a bad thing). Rather than "_______ cemetery, section 23, row 4" or a grave forgotten and covered by long grass. Also rather than "purveyor of an elaborate hoax that sent thousands searching for a non existent treasure."

The poem and the puzzle are about legacy and understanding that is key to solving it.
02-27-2014, 07:26 PM,
Devils Advocate

I understand people having opinions about weather or not...IF this and IF that... I like to ask you, have you tried to solve the poem, are you still trying if you have, and how long did or have you worked on the poem?
02-27-2014, 08:41 PM,
Devils Advocate
Sometimes you just need to have a little faith, and if it's win-win (having fun solving a mystery *and* getting outdoors) regardless then what's the harm either way?

You can also learn a lot about a person from his stories, both written and verbal in order to assist your judgment. In my 1 year of researching the chase and learning about Fenn, I firmly believe he is an honorable character.
02-27-2014, 10:51 PM,
Devils Advocate
I believe he hid it, He siad his family was upset, but I think they would suffer if it was found to be a hoax. I do believe it, but still at times, I ask myself ..REALLY, HA Ha ha you think he did it huh ... over a million, just left it out there somewhere... (me I would have turned around and took it back to the car.)
02-27-2014, 11:27 PM,
Devils Advocate
“Believe none of what you hear, and only half of what you see.”

― Benjamin Franklin

Or we could just say, "Question everything and leave no stone unturned." or "Believe what you want to believe and to each there own."

We all have our own reasons for acceptance. I know I have had a couple of moments of inquisition, Q and A. But I feel those things have been satisfied, at least for me. There are others who will always be doubters no matter how clear the waters run or how full their glass may be. Only they can answer those questions, no one else. ........Why are you here then?

For those intent on their ideas of assuming that others possess some superior understanding of the rest of us and can use "Ruse, effect, statements, etc.," to accomplish their purposes, ........uhuh. Hmmm......... Anyway....... I think in this case, it's a little of a reach. This isn't The Prestige or some Ponzi scheme or black magic. There have also been some who call him a marketing genius……a horse trader and self proclaimed hustler, enough times, if I had a nickel for each one, I wouldn't need a treasure. But those same ones also believe in it. Are they just sitting on the fence drinking some lukewarm ice-t so that either which way it goes they can say they were right? Make up your mind.

You either have faith in it or you don't. It's that simple. Make a choice and either swallow the pill or continue with your anxiety. Things don't have to be so complex, do they? ........An old man hid a tresure chest. And he did it for his own reasons and one of them is to give to others the same feeling he's had so many times throughout his life or perhaps even maybe for it to survive the duration and for someone to find it in the distant future. Nothing wrong with wanting to be apart of that and to be remembered. Either way, it's pretty cool. And I'm sure he will be ok with it no matter what. Does it have to be anything more than that? Would it be so bad if it weren't in Yellowstone or any other spectacular location? Wouldn't it be worth it just to see those places? I doubt he would ever have any regrets about any of us going to such. I don't.
02-27-2014, 11:34 PM,
Devils Advocate
It may not be in New Mexico, but if you ask Siri who her favorite men's college basketball team is right now, she will tell you........
02-28-2014, 01:06 AM,
Devils Advocate
Has anyone come to a point that the more you know the harder it seems because those first search spot(s)when you knew some seemed like it was easy and surely was there but then not finding it there you realized why it was wrong then you learn more and it rules out most of everyplace else. Of course like they say it is better to have loved than not to have loved at all replace love with searched but at what point do you stop. Persistence probably will pay off but by then the time and money spend could balance out the reward. Is it also the more you know the reason why we dismiss other people solves and areas as not the spot. Some searchers have said they will continue but also would like to have it end and someone else find it just to end the Fenn Chase fatigue. I am continuing on but searching for my ah ha moment rather than searching remote woods.
02-28-2014, 01:17 AM,
Devils Advocate
There is no question in my mind that it is real and my chase of it is definitely not the gold rush fever. Many look at Forrest and say look at what he did for a living, he is a salesman, marketer, and an opportunist. Yes he is, and it is these skills that have enabled him to pull this off. He is also at the sunset of his life, money means little to him now, and he has figured out and understands that one of the greatest things in life is to positively affect the lives of others, not just make another buck off them. Getting us off our butts and out into the mountains, studying, researching, and learning things that we would never learn otherwise are positively affecting thousands of people. The alternative to not chasing? Watching tv or doing other meaningless activities that provide little or no real enrichment to ones life? We live in an amazing time, the information, technology, and inventions that exist create so much opportunity and possibility. However, it has also brought an extreme amount of apathy toward experiencing life and the world. I know way to many people where their top priorities are to watch tv and movies, sit and play video games or games on the internet, and filling their lives with trivial and meaningless things while spending their money for stuff provided by others who's' only interest is to make a buck off them.

In my experience, Forrest is a very kind and thoughtful person with no intention to just take advantage of a situation for the sole benefit of himself. My daughter, Brinley, wrote the book report on Dal's blog that was posted there recently. We had sent it to him hoping that it would put a smile on his face, which it did. But then in return, he sent her a copy of his book To Far To Walk and invited her to come have hot chocolate with him sometime. People can have their various opinions, but more important and convincing are experiences, and what he has done is not just about doing things for himself, it is all about doing things that lift and enrich the lives of others.

And someday, he will make someone very happy when that person finds his hidden chest. And everyone else who participated will be all the better too, whether they realize it or not.
02-28-2014, 01:49 AM,
Devils Advocate
I like your questions, <b>Ripsaw</b>. First of all, I'm not a Forrest Fenn advocate, or "Fenner." I disagree with his premise, first of all, that he's doing this to get young people off their game systems and into the outdoors. The treasure hunt is very much an adult endeavor. A 15-year old kid will not have the money and resources to go out into the woods to look for a bronze box when he or she should be focused on school instead. Mr. Fenn encourages unemployed people to take their families to look for the treasure chest - but I think they should focus on getting a job to support their loved ones (the sane option).

I don't think this is the greatest hoax of the century, simply because I think we can find bigger hoaxes if the Fenn treasure turns out to be one. For instance, any person that pulled off a Ponzi scheme this century surely qualifies as a bigger hoax.

In an interview recorded by Toby Younis, I remember one guy saying that he remembers Mr. Fenn buying gold coins from him. However, that's all that was said on camera. I often wonder if he was a paid shill. No name was given, but the authors Mr. Fenn was with said affirmatively: "Well, there's proof right there." Please.

You don't have to imagine if Mr. Fenn is invested in the treasure hunt. Not every penny made from book sales goes to Mr. Fenn, but he is profiting from <i>The Thrill of The Chase</i> and <i>Too Far To Walk</i>. I would be really skeptical if Mr. Fenn released a third book and said there are a few <i>hints</i> in that one as well. Plus, we already know Mr. Fenn met Susana Martinez and there are pictures, even on this forum. Like you said, Mr. Fenn is a businessman (who was never really into art) and he knew how to get prominent people to his location. I even thought about the legacy aspect too: Who would put his own legacy before his own family? That's really interesting.

If this turned out to be false, I know I didn't spend too much time and resources into the search. I would be demoralized a bit, and think about how I couldn't be taken advantage of again, for sure. In a way, this is one of the reasons why I don't share personal information and share my search story, because I refuse to sing and dance for the amusement of a millionaire. I hope this doesn't set up a precedent for members of the idle rich.
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