Not logged in. Login - Register


All new registrations need to be approved manually. After registration, mail me at tyblossom at aol dot com.
ChaseChat is available for Smartphones via Tapatalk, Download the app at http://tapatalk.com/m?id=4&referer=1048173. After installing CLICK HERE to add the forum to Tapatalk.

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Battle of the zealots
07-28-2016, 12:27 PM,
#21
RE: Battle of the zealots
(07-28-2016, 11:00 AM)romeofoxtrot Wrote:
(07-28-2016, 10:40 AM)mdavis19 Wrote: All right. Glad to see you aren't as far out on the lunatic fringe as some of your posts might have suggested. Don't blame me for the sleeper cell suggestion. There are some wild and crazy theories about people on this Forum. I don't subscribe to most of them, but tossing out one from time to time stirs the pot, and often prompts clarification from those involved. Seems to have worked in this case.

Ok, you are somewhere in the middle. Just maybe more (sometimes a lot more) vocal in your criticism than in your praise of Fenn. Got it. That's somewhat normal actually. People are more likely to leave a negative comment or review of a product or service if they are dissatisfied than to leave a positive one if happy. So it really makes me wonder about the motives of the people constantly cheerleading for Fenn.

What portion of responsibility for Randy's death do we assign to Fenn and what portion do we assign to Randy? I know from your political stance that you are a believer in individual responsibility. Should we ban treasure hunts because people can die? "Treasure hunts don't kill people, people kill people," would be the resulting protest chant. Is Fenn entirely guiltless? Hard to say. He could have been more specific about whether the area where Randy died is on the map or not. But then Randy might just have gone somewhere else especially dangerous and had the same result. Fenn could have reiterated yet again about not to do anything an 80 year old man can't do, but nobody listened to him the first 50 times. Fenn has at least strongly implied we shouldn't be out searching the mountains in Winter. Maybe he could have been more specific about that. Fenn could have made the poem easier to solve, and it would have been all over long before Randy had a chance to get involved.

I don't really see a way to assign too much blame to Fenn. Is he totally blameless, probably not in the eyes of a civil court, but in a criminal court...probably not (in my humble non-lawyer opinion). Much of what people are tarring Fenn about seems to be more related to his character, than his culpability.

mdavis19
Id tell you to go back and read my posts, Ive praised Fenn(where credit is due). But if you already havent, you likely wont. I am only vocal because of the Fenn acolytes and the drum-beat of those zombies. There must be balance to the discussion. To assuage Fenn of all of it is absurd. If conspiracy theories are being thrown out there, then one must consider Fenn orchestrating the drum-beat in opposition to drown out the negative press.

I assign some blame to Fenn. How much is up for debate. But zero is nonsense, as much as 100% would be.

Ive been saying my position on the hunt for weeks, well before Randys recent remains discovery. Go back and read them. I know nothing about Fenns character, few do. They only know whats in the book, which is fiction, double-speak, ambiguity, and vagueness.

I am one for individual responsibility. But that includes BOTH Randy and Fenn here. Fenn has an individual responsibilty to mitigate these sorts of happenings, just like WalMart has a responsibility to their customers to mitigate the stampede on Black Friday. Or else they are culpable.

Fenn says "dont go in the winter", but then follows it with "if you know the exact spot you can retrieve it in any weather, probably". Thats irresponsible.

If Fenn wants this to be impossible, thats his right. But tell folks that. no, he wants both sides. He wants all the press that this is possible and simple, that even an average man, or an out of work redneck could solve it. He wants both sides. Thats irresponsible. More contradictions and double-speak. He needs to be honest with the common folks. Fenn has "told the truth, but not all of the truth". And he is playing with peoples lives in doing so.

Can you give us a few examples of how Fenn could mitigate danger in the chase?

mdavis19
Reply
07-28-2016, 12:38 PM,
#22
RE: Battle of the zealots
(07-28-2016, 10:53 AM)Itch my cache Wrote: I can label people.
I'll stick with the equal opportunity troll. I like that.

Deb: old lady (I assume)
Mdavis: dictator
Romeo: Wyoming dude
Ricky: Ricky
Mindy: drama llama attractor
Bet: drama llama activist
Gordon: gay dude who I imagine is wearing an oxygen mask like Bane from Batman
Geyd: guy obsessed with Indians
Ritt: buy my book guy
Will: funny guy
Djj: another drama llama
Becky: smart cookie
Steph: lady in charge
FD: nice guy who argues a lot about dumb things
Project why: pseudo vagina
Deeepthinker: guy who reminds me of a dog that spotted a squirrel.
Buddy: butthead
Wolf: deeepthinker
Illinois ghost: sir search a lot
Cynthia: new Mexico lady
Kpro: new nice guy
Woody: some guy
John Brown: try to be voice of reason guy
Hammer time: Ben affleck
Larsonist: drama llama OG
Milan: Disney dude
Minnie efskin: other Disney dude
Indy: not really Indiana Jones
Astree: codes and ciphers guy
Beavertooth: probably up to something
Chris Yates: guy who's posted on every forum ever
James perotti: question everything guy
Whatiff: most likely to be the guy to live in the last house on a dead end road

Ramona: Not even on your radar
Reply
07-28-2016, 12:45 PM,
#23
RE: Battle of the zealots
(07-28-2016, 12:27 PM)mdavis19 Wrote: Can you give us a few examples of how Fenn could mitigate danger in the chase?

mdavis19

Tell searchers not to go where an 80 year old man couldn't go, wait he already did that. He could also give out safety advice every other time he sends stuff to MW, wait he does that too. A lot on this chase just pick and choose what they want to include as viable information to better suit there argument, those people have fooled themselves from day 1.
Reply
07-28-2016, 01:01 PM,
#24
RE: Battle of the zealots
Example:

"The chase doesn't require you to get wet"

This could save lives. But he won't say this because you probably will have to get wet. Especially since the chest is.

Glad and shocked to see I'm voice of reason guy.
Y'all finally get what I'm trying to do here
Reply
07-28-2016, 01:11 PM,
#25
RE: Battle of the zealots
I think it's too late for Forrest to give any guidance at all. Throughout the chase, he has been encouraging the idea of not following rules. Now whatever he says, there will be some who take this as a hint to be a maverick, and will use their "imagination" to do otherwise.

Archer

(07-28-2016, 12:45 PM)The Count Wrote:
(07-28-2016, 12:27 PM)mdavis19 Wrote: Can you give us a few examples of how Fenn could mitigate danger in the chase?

mdavis19

Tell searchers not to go where an 80 year old man couldn't go, wait he already did that. He could also give out safety advice every other time he sends stuff to MW, wait he does that too. A lot on this chase just pick and choose what they want to include as viable information to better suit there argument, those people have fooled themselves from day 1.
Reply
07-28-2016, 01:37 PM,
#26
RE: Battle of the zealots
I only labeled two people, Deb. (at least I assume they are two different people, and not one playing both sides) Interestingly everyone else seems to be lining up to label themselves. Don't blame me if you weren't mentioned and had to label yourself so you could be outraged at me labeling people.


Actually you drew a line smack dab down the middle and made people choose sides . They are either Forrest haters or zealot zombies who can't think for themselves. Anyone who responded to your taunts was therefore assigned a side.

Itchy, you make a great little pet troll. Do you work for cookies ?
Reply
07-28-2016, 02:44 PM,
#27
RE: Battle of the zealots
(07-28-2016, 01:37 PM)deb Wrote: I only labeled two people, Deb. (at least I assume they are two different people, and not one playing both sides) Interestingly everyone else seems to be lining up to label themselves. Don't blame me if you weren't mentioned and had to label yourself so you could be outraged at me labeling people.


Actually you drew a line smack dab down the middle and made people choose sides . They are either Forrest haters or zealot zombies who can't think for themselves. Anyone who responded to your taunts was therefore assigned a side.

Itchy, you make a great little pet troll. Do you work for cookies ?

You may have read it that way, Deb, but that's not how I meant it. I never said everyone is in either one box or the other. I called myself out as not being in either, but never said I was the only one. It's interesting to see what box people think I put them in. It is very telling.

mdavis19
Reply
07-28-2016, 03:23 PM, (This post was last modified: 07-28-2016, 03:44 PM by ThrillChaser.)
#28
RE: Battle of the zealots
One difference between shopping at Wal Mart and the hiking in the wilderness is that there is a reasonable expectation that shopping at Wal Mart will be a safe experience, and that it is reasonable to believe that it is the responsibility of Wal Mart to ensure that the shopping experience will be safe.

Hiking in the wilderness is not as safe as shopping at Wal Mart, and you need to be better prepared for the potential dangers that accompany that activity. A place like Yellowstone National Park does bear some responsibility for warning people of the dangers, but ultimately it is the responsibility of each individual to educate themselves of the dangers, assess whether they accept the risk, and prepare accordingly. I think you'd find a very small percentage of people who believe that it is the responsibility of YNP to ensure that hiking in its wilderness areas is safe, and I don't think most would consider those people to be reasonable.

What's the motivation for the haters? Good question. I'm pretty sure one constant across all the haters is that they've made zero progress in solving the poem. So, without a doubt, in my opinion, the haters share a deep level of frustration at their own incompetence. Of course, nobody likes to be called incompetent, or admit that they're incompetent, either publicly or to themselves, so it's natural to turn that around and point at and blame someone else. "I'm not incompetent! The poem is impossible! He doesn't want it found for 10,000 years, or ever!" Yawn.

Why would someone who believes that, continue to visit and post at a site ostensibly dedicated to solving this impossible poem? That is the big mystery, but I don't think it requires any conspiracy theories. Treasure hunting is a fringe activity, so we're likely already dealing with a high percentage of fringe personalities.

Since I can't change anyone else's behavior, all I can do is try to act with my own best behavior. In determining whether my behavior is appropriate, I always try to consider the question, "if everyone were to act this way, would this place (ChaseChat) be better (more productive/less noise)?" For me, that means generally trying to only participate in discussions that are related to clues in the poem, or other clues outside the poem (if I think such clues exist), and to ignore those people and discussions that are not related to the poem or other clues.

Edit: After re-reading this, I realized it is a pretty interesting thought experiment to exchange "lovers/haters" with "people who think they have made progress/people who haven't made any progress (and consequently, often believe no one has made progress, lest they would be admitting their own incompetence)."
Reply
07-28-2016, 03:42 PM,
#29
RE: Battle of the zealots
(07-28-2016, 03:23 PM)ThrillChaser Wrote: Since I can't change anyone else's behavior, all I can do is try to act with my own best behavior. In determining whether my behavior is appropriate, I always try to consider the question, "if everyone were to act this way, would this place (ChaseChat) be better (more productive/less noise)?" For me, that means generally trying to only participate in discussions that are related to clues in the poem, or other clues outside the poem (if I think such clues exist), and to ignore those people and discussions that are not related to the poem or other clues.
Well stated, I wish more around here had a thought process like this.
Reply
07-28-2016, 05:44 PM,
#30
RE: Battle of the zealots
(07-28-2016, 03:23 PM)ThrillChaser Wrote: One difference between shopping at Wal Mart and the hiking in the wilderness is that there is a reasonable expectation that shopping at Wal Mart will be a safe experience, and that it is reasonable to believe that it is the responsibility of Wal Mart to ensure that the shopping experience will be safe.

Hiking in the wilderness is not as safe as shopping at Wal Mart, and you need to be better prepared for the potential dangers that accompany that activity.
First, on Black Friday WalMart has killed folks. So it certainly on that day is as dangerous as hiking.

Second, this Chase, according to Fenn is not supposed to be dangerous. He has alluded as much. And that is reasonable to believe that it is the responsibility of Fenn to ensure that the Chase experience will be safe. Which is why some folks mistakenly think they can raft down river during the winter.

(07-28-2016, 12:27 PM)mdavis19 Wrote: Can you give us a few examples of how Fenn could mitigate danger in the chase?

mdavis19

I could. But Fenn would not do them, so there is little point to discuss.
Reply


Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Wa. state, battle Creek, seen wise DeeepThnkr 0 352 07-21-2018, 08:43 PM
Last Post: DeeepThnkr
  Uphill battle on frosty nite 5GIRLS 2 1,213 01-25-2018, 12:56 AM
Last Post: 5GIRLS
  Into the mountain wilderness (away from religious zealots) Andrew Jef 2 1,052 03-13-2017, 11:33 PM
Last Post: Xavier

Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)
Contact Us | ChaseChat - Forrest Fenn's Forum | Return to Top | | Lite (Archive) Mode | RSS Syndication