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Lets Assume. ..
11-13-2013, 12:00 PM,
Lets Assume. ..
I believe in the key concept. For me, the key is the synonyms. Forrest makes reference to words having different meanings in the first few chapters of the book. That was a huge clue for me. So I started looking up every word that I thought might mean something different. I have found some interesting things by doing that. Not only words in the poem, but words in the book as well. I have also compared the poem to the stories in the book and have found some profound similarities. By using that method, I believe I have figured out what the blaze is. I just haven't figured out where to find it.

In the first few chapters, Forrest also talks about bending words a little, non-fiction is true only 85% of the time and that he learned that you always had to tell the truth but you didn't always have to tell the WHOLE truth. That speaks volumes to me.

I know that Forrest said that all you need is the poem. I believe that to be true however, it's highly likely that it would take someone a VERY long time to search every single canyon there is in the 4 states that are left, given that there many wwh. It is my opinion that TTOTC is my study guide, so to speak, of where to find answers to the many questions that arise from the poem. That's just my "take" on all of this.

Happy Hunting Everyone!
11-13-2013, 12:34 PM,
Lets Assume. ..
In fact, I just looked at the inside cover of TTOTC and it says "Unlock the clues that are scattered among these pages and you can go home with a bronze chest"....

So that just solidified my thoughts. For me, anyway.
11-13-2013, 12:52 PM,
Lets Assume. ..
@ SidnCharley, Buy using the keys, the poem gave me the names of two locations North of Santa Fe. Buy drawing lines from those two spots, (my imagination part) I got got the names of a couple other places.
11-13-2013, 03:48 PM,
Lets Assume. ..
Toby you wrote: “<i>Apparently, we should be looking at the Forrest, and not the trees.</i>” Interesting way of putting it and a good thought.

How does one get to know a person that says “<i>It doesn’t matter who you are it only matters who they think you are</i>”?

Many folks here could tell you where his favorite place to eat is and most probably what he would order. We all know of his love for Yellowstone and Wyoming. We know of his attachment to New Mexico, its heritage and fascination with collecting Native American artifacts. We know a lot about Fenn’s likes and dislikes. Many of us could tell you what he would do or say in many circumstances; but does that tell us anything……..We are trying to apply “normal” behavior to a very abnormal act (hiding the chest). Sometimes I think the more I know about him the more wild goose chases I end up on.

Fenn is above all a marketing genius……a horse trader and self proclaimed hustler. He made his money by buying stuff and convincing someone to pay more for it than he did.

One might think the obvious location of the chest is in New Mexico or Wyoming based on what we know about him………But does the attachment to those places have anything to do with where a hustler would hide a chest of gold.

I can hear him now……..<i>It doesn’t matter where it is, it only matters where they think it is</i>.

11-13-2013, 04:00 PM,
Lets Assume. ..
@ SidnCharley, Another thought, I just realized that the two keys I used on the poem, were both based on knowing what State and area to look in, to start, and the keys were custom designed to the area. So without some external information, I could only take the poem at face value.
11-13-2013, 04:24 PM,
Lets Assume. ..
GOG: I think an inordinate weight has been given his "non-clue" statement. Didn't you eke out an admission from him finally that "not in Utah or Idaho" were in fact useful information? It was particularly useful for those who were searching in those states. Similarly the "not in a potty" and "not in a grave yard" statements would have been useful for searchers focusing on outhouses and cemeteries. Those clues would have been useless for those of us who weren't searching in those places but very useful for those who were.
11-13-2013, 05:27 PM,
Lets Assume. ..
I believe Forrest's non-clue statement referenced by Tyounis above is itself a fantastic clue into how to solve the poem. If Mr. Fenn meant what he said then you have to ask yourself why he would say that? Why would his understanding of the puzzle he created lead him to say that? To me the conclusion is that knowing a general geographic location (not in Utah, etc) and knowing specific places not to look (not in outhouses) means nothing to ultimately solving the poem because there is (almost) no chance someone will stumble upon the chest without a precise location and because the poem leads precisely to the chest. So the question to me is how can the poem lead precisely to the chest?
11-13-2013, 06:02 PM,
Lets Assume. ..
Thanks, Pooka- how can the poem lead precisely to the chest? The right question.

tralou2you- I agree with your point about the importance of words- the meanings, even the look and feel of them. Interestingly enough, in TTOTC Forrest says that if he has to look up a word he doesn't use it, but at Moby Dickens he said that he likes to look up the meanings of words (he had ready the example of "several"), and see what they really mean. Interesting contradiction. And while TTOTC "suddenly appeared on my computer screen" and he took great liberties with the text, the poem was distilled over many years down to its essence.

I feel that the poem can tell you everything you need to know, even if you found the poem on the ground and it said "Poem to find the treasure chest" on it and you didn't know anything about Forrest.

What SidnCharley said:

"But what if you knew nothing of the poem's author. Would that automatically disqualify a person from finding the chest?"

I believe absolutely not. But, I feel that there's quite a bit of buttressing of the clue solutions in TTOTC, and otherwise in things that Forrest has said and done, and also one's understanding of the person. The book does not for me determine wwwh, but it increases confidence in the probability of the solution after you have it. I am not a complete poem purist, as I have scoured both books and greatly disfigured my TTOTC. I just keep the books at bay.

I see the solution to wwwh as giving you the precise beginning, and also the end but not the precise hiding place.

I see the clue solutions informing us about the blaze, and that it's confirmed in the poem that you've "found" the right one. I expect the poem to lead right to the chest as Forrest said, and that the "search area" is no larger than the footprint of a double-wide.



11-13-2013, 08:33 PM,
Lets Assume. ..
John, the whole useless clue stuff made no sense to me. I think he boxed himself in and didn’t know how to get out of it. He made a "useless clue" statement a long time before he wrote it on Dal’s blog. He said the clues he gave on the Today show wasn’t going to help anyone. If I were the Today Show producer I would have went through the roof.

When he said that there was a pause to the clues on the Today Show; the next clue he gave on the show was the “not in Idaho or Utah” clue; which most of us thought was substantial. That was the last clue he gave on the show. Obviously Fenn and the Today Show were at odds. It looks like Fenn mouthed off and made the producers mad, and they were insisting he give substantial clues. This is a silly mistake I wouldn’t think a marketing genius would make…..I couldn’t believe he did that, but I (and most of the searchers I knew of) blew it off as Fenn being his contrary self……

Then Fenn posted a statement to the same effect on Dal’s blog. I couldn’t believe he did that but I still blew it off until I got bombarded with emails wanting to know if the cheat sheet was useless…….. I could see Fenn making an offhanded remark at a question/answer session but he’s a professional writer and wrote that statement on Dal’s blog. To me they were asking a legitimate question and I felt like I owed those folks an answer, so I started pushing.

He then come out with the-- if a clue doesn’t lead you directly to the treasure it’s useless-- statement. Which made no sense to me either; for example solving WWWH does not lead you directly to the treasure; it’s obviously an accumulation of the clues that leads you to the treasure not just one. But by his statement eight of the nine clues would be useless except the last one. He seemed to be digging the hole he was in deeper…….But, I did give that statement some thought……….The only scenario I could think of that would make that statement true is if all of the nine clues point to the same location, then all of the clues would lead you directly to the treasure……But that really doesn’t make sense either.

That’s pretty much the “useless clue” saga…….You can go back and read it all if you want, I posted all the emails between Fenn and I in their entirety. Fenn gave one of his usual non-answers and that was that.

It still makes no sense to me………It boils down to each searcher has to decide what is important and what is not; and that covers a very broad spectrum as Fenn has intended it to.
11-13-2013, 08:44 PM,
Lets Assume. ..
Ultimately there is no "poem purism."


So you're a "poem purist." How do you interpret this string of meaningless symbols?

As I have gone alone in there And with my treasures bold, I can keep my secret where, And hint of riches new and old. Begin it where warm waters halt And take it in the canyon down, Not far, but too far to walk. Put in below the home of Brown. From there it's no place for the meek, The end is ever drawing nigh; There'll be no paddle up your creek, Just heavy loads and water high. If you've been wise and found the blaze, Look quickly down, your quest to cease, But tarry scant with marvel gaze, Just take the chest and go in peace. So why is it that I must go And leave my trove for all to seek? The answers I already know, I've done it tired, and now I'm weak. So hear me all and listen good, Your effort will be worth the cold. If you are brave and in the wood I give you title to the gold.

A: What do you mean meaningless symbols? This is clearly English.

Q: What is English?

A: bah you're an idiot.

You can't be a "poem purist". A poem purist would start with meaningless symbols and then assign meaning to the symbols. We accept without question that the poem is in English and that we can look up the meaning of the words in an English dictionary. This means that we have thousands of years of history built into our starting point which is the English language.

Then what do you say, "ok English, but nothing more?" Would that mean that to be a poem purist one cannot look stuff up in books, maps, google, libraries, etc? I don't think there's anybody out there who thinks this, but there are lots who claim to be "poem purists." So if it is reasonable for a poem purist to use outside sources, read a book, look up a word then how do you distinguish between a "poem purist" and a "poem non-purist"? Is it like the supreme court's definition of pornography? You dunno but you know it when you see it? Can a user of a key be a poem purist? If the key-ist can solve the poem using the key as a crutch, then discard the key and have the solution still make sense is she a poem-purist? If not, then why can the poem-purist use anything other than the string of meaningless symbols above?

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